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18 Mar 2013 21:00 #125774
by Kwami
Although it might sound kooki , I happen to think that Kanhai, Sobers were indeed greater than Bradman. Lets face it real baseball started with the advent of Jackie Robinson an in Bradman time it was whites playing against whites. Even the westindies team was white with a few token blacks thrown in who excelled when given the chance .
The body line series exposed his weakness and people like Hall and Griffits would have killed him not the mentioned the fearsome foursome of later years.
That Bradman is the greatest is just to stroke the white mans ego , he wasnt the greatest.
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boquiesse
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19 Mar 2013 08:38 #125804
by boquiesse
Kwami, in the "bodyline" series Bradman failed with an average of 56.57.
Look at the WI batting line up in their Australian tour of 75/76 - did not Australia expose the "weakness" of those players against top class fast bowling?
High class fast bowling will always get the better of batting - by this I mean that the team that possesses those bowlers will generally win test series.
All of this still does not explain why Bradman's average is so much higher than his contemporaries.
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boquiesse
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19 Mar 2013 08:50 #125806
by boquiesse
Mapoui, IMO it's a futile argument trying to compare Bradman with "modern" batsmen and we have no way of knowing how he would have coped.
You mention him playing on wet pitches and failing but his lowest series average is 56.57 so I am not sure where the failure is.
You mentioned Hammond whose average in England was 50.06 and Len Hutton whose home average was 57.79.
You stated that an average of 99 was possible but my point is that no one has come even close to it.
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mapoui
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19 Mar 2013 09:37 - 19 Mar 2013 09:51 #125817
by mapoui
Boqui
Bradman played over 70% of his tests in Australia..at home, on Oz pitches, in front of Oz audiences.
he creamed India in 1947. do you have any idea how weak India was in 1947?
against west indies in 1931 he scored a 223 and a 152. yet west indies had their moments against in that series, bowling him down cheaply at least twice in. Bradman batted about 6 times in that series and did not score well at least 3 times..at home in Oz.
Early in that series he could not deal with George Francis of Guyana...then Constantine and F R Martin got him. then in the fifth test which west indies won, second innings with the game on the line, Bradmans stumps were spread-eagled for nought by Herman Griffith.
in 2 innings of that series Bradman scored a double and a big ton. otherwise he was well contained and controlled by west indies pace
his double was scored at some exhibition ground in Brisbane. his big ton was scored at Melbourne. wherever the conditions gave them even the semblance of a chance west indies pace contained, beat and out Bradman for low scores
at home in Oz Bradman also creamed the Saffies who were also not good at the time. when he got pace in his rass from Francis, Griffith and Constantine he tended to wilt. later on in the Bodyline series he did not score as he had been doing previously and afterward.
those factors are bound to be decisive even if Bradmans average was 100 perfect..playing most of his career at home and in england..never having to cope with all the conditions of the world... the problems of travel, food etc.
Bradman must have been good to have averaged 99. I do give him something.
headly was very high too which average was brought down by playing in his old age. worrell also had a humungus average which was also very diluted by playing well into his later years.
then again the question of wet wickets..a very serious question in those days of uncovered wickets. Bradman always failed when challenged by unusual conditions which suggests that outside of england and australia he would have had a hard time
the more I look at Bradman I see feet of clay...a one-off kind of freak
Last edit: 19 Mar 2013 09:51 by mapoui.
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mapoui
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19 Mar 2013 09:58 #125822
by mapoui
Bradman averaged 74:50 against west indies in 1931.
his scores were 4, 25, 223, 152, 43, 0....6 by 447 for 74:50
but from that chronology you can see what happened. west indies bowling had him..he got away for 2 scores and then back under control
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19 Mar 2013 11:11 #125854
by ketchim
he from Barbados.....here's a 1923 Pic
Fancis and Constantine sitting in the front row !
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19 Mar 2013 11:17 #125857
by ketchim
Herman Griffiths the 1923 tour of England because of the territory quota system: >
George Francis being preferred.
Griffith and Francis together, however, shook the 1925-26 MCC team when they went down
by an innings to Barbados.
They took nine wickets each.
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mapoui
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19 Mar 2013 11:26 #125864
by mapoui
man..I always had in mind that Francis was Guyanese. are you sure?
let me see!
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THE PITCH
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Rohan Kanhai is greater than Bradman
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