WI Best Players of Spin bowling

who are they and how would you rank them?

[quote author=Goog Lee link=topic=92970.msg590618#msg590618 date=1411743981]
who are they and how would you rank them?
[/quote]

* Take a look at the batting averages of WI batsmen against subcontinent teams(India/Pak/Bang/SL)---min runs 1000:

Quote:[size=12pt]92.85 Weekes
85.41 Sobers
76.11 Walcott
61.55 Chanderpaul
56.65 Kanhai
52.67 Lloyd
52.62 Lara[/size]

* Click on the link to see the stats:

LINK: Stats


NOTE:

* Richards and Kali did not average 50+ against subcontinent teams.

Rev

ahh, interesting stats, Rev!

but is that how you would rank their ability to play spin, based on stats?

The stats is a good starting point but not everything. 

for example, no one in their right mind would say that Chanderpaul is a better player of spin than Kalli! 

[quote author=Goog Lee link=topic=92970.msg590624#msg590624 date=1411744781]
ahh, interesting stats, Rev!

but is that how you would rank their ability to play spin, based on stats?

The stats is a good starting point but not everything. 

for example, no one in their right mind would say that Chanderpaul is a better player of spin than Kalli! 
[/quote]

* THE NUMBERS ARE REAL.

* Let's look at Kali and Shiv versus India.

Quote:[size=12pt]KALI: In 15 tests against India Kali scored 1229 runs at an average of 55.86 with 3 hundreds and 7 fifties.

SHIV: In 25 tests against India Shiv has scored 2171 runs at an avg of 63.85 with 7 hundreds and 10 fifties.[/size]

STATS

* The Rev never engages in arguing---I just present the numbers.

* No question Kali was a great player of spin, but the NUMBERS don't lie---Shiv has better numbers against India.

Rev

Spin Bowling mus be looked at by Era :

Before and After the Invention of the Doosra and the Carom ball !!

Samjay ?

We can ONLY guess at how older Batsmen would have negotiated those 2 deliveries !

[quote author=ketchim link=topic=92970.msg590631#msg590631 date=1411745327]
Spin Bowling mus be looked at by Era :
Before and After the Invention of the Doosra and the Carom ball !!
Samjay ?
[/quote]

* Kali played from 1972 to 1980

* Was he the best in that period against India ?

* NOT BY A LONG SHOT

* Richards, Abbas, Lloyd and Miandad all averaged in the 60s against India between 72-80.

* Kalli averaged 55+

* See link for stats:

STATS

Rev

None of them played Murali and saqlain Doosra and Carom balls...

and Warnie !

Murali has over 700 TEST Scalps ....

Warnie and saq got nuff as well !

Gibbs from the other era just a tad over 300 

I submit that Gibbs ,Ram and Val :

had NO idea of the Existence of these 2 deliveries.

Saq came along and invented One .....Methink Murali or warnie the other one !

Puss Achong was the Last previous Invention : the Chinaman